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Too many people ignore that ben isn't really EVER trying to hurt rey when they fight. He's defending himself, he's wearing her down, but he's not really attacking. She's all in usually. He's defending.

I really want Ben to have a chat with Anakin in the world beyond worlds to really solidify the connection between their stories

Hey there, really enjoyed the video! I would love to get these as audio only, are you on audea?

I always thought it would have been cool if when Ben turns back after he'd thrown his lightsaber into the ocean, in the eyeline of where Han had been standing was the millenium falcon with Finn and Poe arguing about Rey leaving them and what to do next (I actually thought that that was what was going to happen and was jumping in my seat in the cinema before...disappointment); and [SPOILERS for ATLA season 3] like Zuko approaching the gAang in Atla, Ben had approached Finn, Poe, Chewie, Jannah and BB8 and because (in this version he had released Chewie), and because of Rey saving him - Ben explains the force bond and they have an uneasy alliance to try and find Rey. There's also a storm trooper uprising in this one because come on guys Finn could have had such an amazing arc that was set up across the movies alongside Ben becoming a "traitor" and "rebel scum." I also would of had DJ come back and be the spy instead of Hux as a first order coder, as sort of a mini redemption for his character; and then you could of had that spicy rivalry with Hux come to ahead - him taking over the First Order after Kylo Ren "betrays" them. This movie could have been so good and it keeps me up at night hoping that they continue their stories in some way where these interactions can happen because they're such GOOD characters, but anyway... Ben Solo Lives 🦋💙, and if there's hope, then there's possibility. (I know this video was posted 2 years ago, but with the new Kenobi series coming out soon my love for Star Wars has been blossoming again, and that love always comes back round to the sequel trilogy characters, reylo and the podcasts that made me love them and their mythic symbolism even more <3).

The Legacy family was destroyed, and it left a bad taste in fans mouth.

2 years later and it's still a conundrum, what they did / meant to do with TROS

To me this a problem that goes beyond movies. Sometimes people can't really make up their minds on what they want from female characters or women in general. Other than "STRONG FEMALE CHARACTERS"! Then never explaining on what they mean on STRONG INDEPENDENT WOMAN! For me, I just want good characters. Regardless of whatever gender they're in between their legs.

they had a big opportunity to do something great with her and Ren and even Finn (not so much Poe, he's just another Han really..) and they screwed it up. I hope they build out the sequel stuff more

Maybe I am just different but if you meant the sequel trilogy not making anyone love star wars, then I am the exception. I had never watched more than 5 mintues in passing of star wars before TFA and that was a month before TROS. In 3-4 months after that, I watched every single star wars thing besides lego series and haven't gotten around to Solo. I need to get past the no harrison as Han

I think they wanted to turn Rey into a copy of Luke. The female sexuality in the sequel is something to be rejected, but the most beloved hero of this saga is practically a celibate priest - Luke who conquered his sexual urges by defeating the "shit monster with a toothed vagina" Jabba The Hut. Canonically Luke is a saint so rey should also be for the public to like her. Star Wars was sexist in the sequel but throughout the saga we see that sex is treated as something punishable by death even for non-jedi- Anakin falls on the dark side and loses padmé, han and Leia die and the son falls to the dark side, Rey loses Ben. Luke didn't have sex, but was punished by his nephew's fall into the shadowy area (breaking a pattern). But he returned to being "hero" in the nine. Star Wars in general is not just a sexist franchise with women, but it praises chastity on a sick level.

So much complexity, for ep IX to simply completely regress Rey an angry child, who praises the "sir" who blocks his sexual awakening and still turns his power into something bad inherited from a psychopath. Murdered an incredible character... Revolting...

Great video. I liked the mentions of Sansa Stark/Petyr Baelish and Carol Danvers / Jon-Rogg too.

I'm watching this almost 2 years after TROS came out and I realize how much I miss your vidoes guys.

He's an Onion. Onions have layers; which makes him a great and appealing character. This character relates to so many people in reality.

Kylo has borderline personality disorder just like Anakin

Personally I wouldn't want Timothee Chalamet to play Cardan because I don't think popular young actors should be cast. I think it would be great to let new talent be given a chance to shine. Especially those beginning their career. It should be a role that they become known for as their career progresses.

The TROS novelization states that when Ben Solo came to Exegol for the final battle, Rey saw him as more confident and relaxed. She even saw the resemblance between him and his parents; Han’s long face and posture and Leia’s warm brown eyes.

He'd have to have an arch like Zuko's from Avatar.

One thing that I found interesting is that Ben/Kylo is mentioned to be a focal point in The Force between light and dark, which is why he's so torn and conflicted. The Force is literally playing tug of war with him. The Rise Of Kylo Ren comics even make a brief reference to this.

11:54 i can understand why that's uncomfortable, but let's be real. Cliegg Lars wasn't abusing her, he more or less needed someone to care for him and his disability. its fucked up but historically this is what humans have done to each other and still do. sex trafficking, forced marriage, a lot of this still happens. would Shmi have gone with Cliegg willingly if it meant freedom from slavery? who knows. but i don't think Cliegg is bad, the system is bad

i disagree, i don't think Ben deserves that fairytale ending after killing and committing genocide against so many

Never noticed the hand symbolism, brilliant.

Came into this video blind and I loved it! Was subconsciously yearning for this sort of character analysis my whole life. Will definitely be watching more On another note, let's appreciate how Star Wars has given us so much great characters and ideas to work with and think about

I'm so sad that you girls will no longer be making any content for this channel, but I do understand why you decided to stop. I just wanted to thank all of you for everything you have created these past few years. Your videos on reylo, literature and mythology were eye-opening and interesting. I've learned so much from you and always felt like this was a safe space to enjoy this part of the star wars fandom. Your videos have meant more to me than you will ever know. I want to thank you for everything and wish you all a healthy and happy 2021. May the force be with you, always! 💜🌌

Thanks for the good work, it makes writing these characters more thought out, less instinctive. I always have trouble with writing Rey, but you make me realize how too close to home she is for me.

This entire think about female protagonists not been able to have love interests because it makes them weak, reminds me the situation of Tauriel in The Hobbit trilogy. I heard so many people saying than she is weaker because she fell in love and that she couldn't be Captain Of The Guard AnD love at the same time. Just unfair...

So you’re saying that women can only be happy if they have a boyfriend? 😂😂😂 Also ask Star Lord about how the male superheroes always get their love interests. 😂 But that doesn’t mean superheroes are lonely! 😂 You really don’t understand the genre! You know Batman has a whole family and there’s teams like the justice league and the avengers. You really think superheroes are always alone? Lmfao OMG you think heaviness during action was invented in superhero films I just can’t every second there’s another stupid point being made! Just admit it you’re pissed off because your self insert character didn’t get to fuck the hot bad boy! 😂 I’ll leave this here: Finn and Rey is a better couple than Rey and Ben even if Ben wasn’t a completely fascist! Also “Dr. poison’s much worse than Ben Solo.” That’s because she’s less attractive, right?

Very good analysis, although I've seen it argued that Kylo Ren demonstrates more of a borderline personality disorder, as did his grandfather Anakin, than narcissistic traits, although he does show signs of both at different times.

I didn’t get the Wonder Woman/Captain Marvel references but I definitely got a Marvel vibe. Rey’s “I am all the Jedi” made me laugh out loud and found myself thinking about RDJs “I am Iron Man” moment. I also found myself wondering if Disney was going for a “heroic sacrifice” a la Iron Man but they didn’t spend enough time building up the tragedy of Ben Solo to have much of an impact. Don’t even get me started on the “Rey Skywalker” nonsense. I hated this movie so much. What a horrible end to a much loved franchise. It’s a pity too, because Rey, Finn and Kylo/Ben had such strong introductions. Kylo fared the best but Rey and Finn were ultimately useless characters. Poe was an afterthought despite how great Oscar Issac is. This movie really soured me on the whole of Star Wars.

Delicious podcast. I spent the last year deeply in love with Kylo. He's so complex and, for me, the only character well developed. Still in love with his complexity. I want to hug him!!!! <3 #savebensolo

Thanks for the video!

I didn't like Captain Marvel as a movie but I loved the scene towards the end when her mentor was basically trying to get her to prove herself to him by fighting him without her powers. But she doesn't do it and I thought that was perfect. The idea that women have to prove themselves is what I hated most about TRoS. But I agree with everything else you said about the role basically being gender neutral so it doesn't feel like I'm really watching the first female lead marvel movie. Rey didn't choose to be a Skywalker she asked for permission just like she had to earn "Lukes" saber, she had to earn his name as well.

JJ somehow managed to play it so stupidly safe that it actually looped back around to being a risk 😫

You know what I'm going to make this simple. If it hadn't been for Rey we wouldn't have Wonder Woman 2017 and Captain Marvel 2019. Thank you Rey thank you Daisy Ridley.

I am amazed how you girls find these analogies! Missed you! My favorite podcast 😍

I must say this is the best star wars podcast I've listen to. Keep up with the good work!

My main problem with TROS is that they introduce Rey Palpatine and do nothing with it. They show that she can accidentally use Force Lightning, but not be able to do it intentionally? The final showdown would have been far more interesting if Palpatine fired lightning and Rey was able to counter/block it. Similar to the Aang and Ozai final battle in ATLA, where the villain uses lightning trying to kill the hero and the hero is able to control and redirect it. In my version of the final battle after Palpatine casts Ben Solo into the abyss and Rey stands up, there's a lightning beam struggle between them that ends in a stalemate. Then the resolution arrives when Ben climbs out of the abyss picks up the legacy saber and impales Palpatine while he's distracted. Then he loses control of his lightning and it ends up killing him. At least this way they both contribute to the victory and both survive and Rey's lineage can still be important.

Thank you for discussing this important and nuanced issue that was on the forefront of my mind walking out of TROS, and drove so much of my disappointment. As upset as I was over Ben's death and the destruction of the Skywalker bloodline (and honestly WHERE WAS ANAKIN!?), I was also devastated that they took the relatable and intriguingly rich character of "New Anakin" to Ben's "New Vader" TLJ Rey (so unusual for a female character in film), and flattened and contorted TROS Rey into a subpar and unlikable version of the "women" that in their profoundly narrow view Hollywood continues to shove down our throats. Wish we could be having a different conversation than "what should have been," but as usual appreciate your strong work.

My lovely girls. I love you ❤️

49:35 Black Widow in different comics married or had a love relantioship with basically EVERY male Avenger member (except for a few like Thor and Black Phanter but for obvious reasons), wich of course fans hated this "lack" of romantic pairing in the cinematic version. P.S: if really Lucasfilm wanted Rey to resemble an Marvel heroine, then Wanda is knocking the door since Infinity War (ironically Ben like Vision) and recently with the upcoming "WandaVision" tv series on Disney+.

Disney really hasn't done too well with female characters recently. Just look at all their live action remakes. And while the original animated characters were a little problematic, they still had more character development.

Miss guys

I love ReyLo, loved your SWC channel, and your ongoing commitment and passion for Star Wars. i too have a love of and attachment to SW. it took me some time but I love the ST, including TROS. I hope someone does great work to reveal a child of Rey and Ben down the road but to know that once again love saved the world, and redeemed Kylo, and Ben did what Anakin could not-save the one he loved from dying- ❤️❤️❤️❤️ and that Rey was saved too, having stopped Kylo who did not want to kill her but was still not redeemed and wanted to rule the galaxy without remorse for the massacres or murders he perpetrated- Rey used the force to bring him back- Kylo-not Ben, he was still Kylo then but Rey felt the Force go off balance with Leia’s loving sacrifice. I agree the Force is not a superpower or power one has. you raised interesting parallels but Leia’s love for her son, Han’s love, support and forgiveness (not his blaster or fast talking “super powers”) -to me that is absolutely SW and an awesome way to conclude their arcs and immortalize their legacy . Thank you for all of your thoughtful broadcasts ✌🏼⭐️ May the Force be with you 👏🏽

Rey unfortunately never seems to fully resolve or come to terms with her inner demons. In TROS everything "negative" for her appears to be neatly swept under the rug. All those inner feelings and desires of hers are jammed into a box labeled "DO NOT ACKNOWLEDGE." Her character truly becomes the queen of denial.

Your talking about how male directors and writers try to appeal to women and fail so badly reminded me of a certain scene from season 2 of The Boys, which, for those who don't know, takes the idea of superheroes are brings them to a very dark extreme. You know that Hollywood's "dudebro" attitude is getting bad when female "heroine" Stormfront, an honest to God Nazi who wants elevate those with powers to be the new master race, calls out the shows version of J.J. Abrams for making women either the damsel in distress or an utter bitch. And she gets cheered. As for the last bit of TROS, when Rey was walking into the sunset I didn't really get the sense that this was the end of her story. When Luke did that it marked the beginning of his adventures, and word around the campfire is that DLF will eventually continue Rey's story, and by extension they will have to continue Ben's. He's already getting an animated series on Disney+, or it's at least in early development, which shows that Disney is acknowledging how popular Ben is. And sooner or later they will run out of in-universe time to cover everything leading up to TROS. After that it's just beating a dead horse, where as they can bring him back from the dead, and there are several ways for that to happen, and make Ben a Rey a cash cow begging to be milked.

Hello there!

Èlite: Lù: I killed Polo by accident. The others: Ok, it was an accident. Baby: Chiara: I became a prostitute, 'cause I was bored. ( For the same reason that Dianna became Wonder Woman) The others: Ok, you need a chance. Star Wars: Rey: I brought peace to the universe. The others: You have to punished very hard for that.

In the end the writers didnt respect rey enough to make her a character they left her as a hollow empowerment doll and threw it at women as if we should be satisfied with that... we need more diverse and developed character traits in powerful women generally

the reality is that many star wars fans see the Jedi as a power fantasy, specifically concerning physical strength, and since the current mainstream definitions of power in films are from marvel superheroes, the directors tried to update the Jedi power fantasy to resemble marvel's. TBH this shows imaginative bankruptcy and a lack of understanding of what makes the jedi special more than anything else. So uncivilized